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Graphics card with open source drivers!

   

OSS Graphics supportIn my experience, and apparently the experience of others, finding a graphics card which is supported by open source drivers is a bit of a challenge. Either the open source driver support is poor or limited, or there are simply no open source drivers at all. Many people resort to buying used cards from eBay.

Frustrated, I have decided to start a project to solve the problem. Since I am a chip designer, and I work for a company that sells graphics cards, I decided to approach management with the idea, and they agreed that if I could justify it economically, we would do it. The primary objective is to produce a graphics product which has fully open documentation and fully open source driver.



When I first brought up the idea on the Linux Kernel Mailing List, it received quite a bit of attention. Lots of discussion on LKML resulted in an article on kerneltrap.org, followed by a link from Slashdot.

Now, there is a mailing list dedicated to this project which can be found at:
http://lists.duskglow.com/mailman/listinfo/open-graphics

A preliminary feature spec can be found at:
http://open-graphics.duskglow.com/openspec.pdf or
http://www.techsource.com/Open_Graphics/Open_Graphics_Spec.pdf

In addition, one of the list members put online a petition pertaining to pricing of the proposed graphics card:
http://www.petitiononline.com/3dc4rdlb/petition.html
(I think the petition will be valuable feedback for the company to determine viability.)

As someone who uses Linux as his primary platform, both at home and at work, I would really love to see something like this come to fruition.

Unfortunately, the attention people have paid to this project has started to wane. I figure either people really aren't that interested, or they just don't know about it. I decided to test the waters by posting to a few different forums around on the web. It turns out that there are plenty of interested people, but they just haven't heard about it because word hasn't spread.

Although my employer is capable of and willing to help me to market this, they have not taken an intrusive role in the project, in part because they understand that this is not a normal project. This is more of a community project than it is a "Tech Source" project, and they have respected that. Unfortunately, being an engineer rather than a sales person, I haven't had huge success on my own in generating the necessary awareness among those who would be interested in this sort of thing.

To that end, I would like to humbly ask interested parties who read this to please pass the word around. (And also participate in the discussions and development process.)

I hope you don't see this as a plea for free advertizing but rather as an opportunity to take part in the development of graphics hardware which is compatible with Free Software principles. I honestly believe that there is a major need, and I would like to be part of meeting that need.

(edit by bart) see also www.opengraphics.org




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Graphics card with open source drivers! | 17 comments | Create New Account
The following comments are owned by whomever posted them. This site is not responsible for what they say.
Graphics card with open source drivers!
Authored by: bart on Thursday, November 25 2004 @ 11:33 PM CET
I definitely see a need for this. As you can read in my article about comparison of raphics cards on FreeBSD, the only thing that really works and performs well is the hardware that NVIDIA offers, and that doesn't come with open source drivers

In the past I went with Matrox because of their good support for OSS, but with the P series that seems to have gone out of the window, and the drivers they have are not usable for most people from what I can tell, which basicly means you can go with outdated hardware and OSS drivers, or modern hardware and no accelerated 3d support if you get drivers at all (unless we are talking nvidia or in some cases ati)

So.. keep up the good work, and keep us posted please.
Graphics card with open source drivers!
Authored by: theosib on Thursday, November 25 2004 @ 11:47 PM CET
Thank you for the encouragement. I'm hoping that people
will talk about this amongst each other and that soon the
awareness will reach critical mass. I'm very anxious to
get started on the implementation, but that can't happen
until enough people (in the thousands) have demonstrated
an interest.
Graphics card with open source drivers!
Authored by: bart on Friday, November 26 2004 @ 12:06 AM CET
Reaching critical mass is often the problem with such projects it seems. Judging from the references I get from Google, quite a few people are in fact looking for information on graphics cards on Linux (and to a lesser extent, FreeBSD), so you'd think the potential is there.

Looking around myself I find lots of different posts to mailinglists but no prominent repository of information and a (web based) discussion board related to graphics hardware on open source platforms.

Would it be an idea to setup such a thing?
Graphics card with open source drivers!
Authored by: theosib on Friday, November 26 2004 @ 12:43 AM CET
Well, if my mailing list (mentioned in the article) isn't
enough, then, yes, someone should set up a web page all
about this. Any suggestions? Perhaps someone on my
mailing list could do it.
Graphics card with open source drivers!
Authored by: bart on Friday, November 26 2004 @ 12:50 AM CET
Hmm, a mailinglist works fine for discussing I think, even more so when it has a good archive. I do think that web based discussions are easier to find for 'outsiders', and also easier to read and join. Mailinglists are somewhat easier to follow for 'insiders' tho I think.

I can easily setup a site for it, but I'd only do so if people are interested in participating (heh... the critical mass problem again) so that it gets content from multiple sources.

Right now I feel more like adding a seperate section for it to my site tho.
Graphics card with open source drivers!
Authored by: theosib on Friday, November 26 2004 @ 01:22 AM CET
I would be very happy about it if you had a special
section for this on your site. We should cross link
between the mailing list and your discussion forum. Just
give me an appropriate URL, and I'll add the link to the
list main page.

Thanks!
Graphics card with open source drivers!
Authored by: bart on Friday, November 26 2004 @ 01:29 AM CET
Well, there we go.
url is http://soapbox.bartsplace.net/index.php?topic=Graphics
Graphics card with open source drivers!
Authored by: theosib on Friday, November 26 2004 @ 01:46 AM CET
Excellent! Thank you! Now, my only concern is that I may
not be able to do a good job of following both forums,
particularly when I get onto doing the development work.
Hopefully, some members of both forums will cross-post
summaries of interesting discussions.
Graphics card with open source drivers!
Authored by: bart on Friday, November 26 2004 @ 01:49 AM CET
Yep. I subscribed to the mailinglist so I will be following that myself and make references here when I have time and see interesting things.

You can use a newsticker to keep track of my site, will have to look a bit into setting up a seperate rss feed for this section.
Graphics card with open source drivers!
Authored by: Anonymous on Saturday, November 27 2004 @ 05:57 PM CET
Just an artist passing through. I wanted to let you know that this is very much a valuable venture for all concerned. I am keenly interested in a cutting edge FOSS compatible graphics card with good nonproprietary drivers. You should really also seriously consider informing GIMP users also. I heard of your efforts on a Blender3d site and was greatly encouraged by the idea.
Graphics card with open source drivers!
Authored by: theosib on Saturday, November 27 2004 @ 10:02 PM CET
Thanks for the tip. I checked out the GIMP site, and I
decided that it was probably off-topic to post to any of
their mailing lists (I can't affort to get on people's bad
side). I decided to email their webmaster, but I don't
know if it'll get anywhere.

While I have been received well in the places I have
posted, I'm concerned that my obvious bias towards my own
project will count against me. It's better when people
who are not me spread the word around, especially when
there is more than one of them.
Graphics card with open source drivers!
Authored by: theosib on Sunday, November 28 2004 @ 12:02 AM CET
We got picked up on osnews:

http://www.osnews.com/comment.php?news_id=9003

Now, we just need several people to post that to slashdot, and perhaps we'll get some momentum going. Anyone want to join me in that? :)

Graphics card with open source drivers!
Authored by: bart on Sunday, November 28 2004 @ 12:18 AM CET
Heh, I just did .
Graphics card with open source drivers!
Authored by: Anonymous on Sunday, November 28 2004 @ 11:37 AM CET
Hope this will become a success.

Now I have to look for a registration here, to not post anonymously...;)

-- Kung (www.linux-gamers.net) --
Graphics card with open source drivers!
Authored by: Anonymous on Monday, November 29 2004 @ 07:18 AM CET
There's some momentum.

http://cva.stanford.edu/imagine/

http://merrimac.stanford.edu/

http://www.xilinx.com/products/boards/multimedia/

http://www.clearspeed.com/

http://www.icculus.org/manticore/

Feature connector - present but not implemented
Authored by: Anonymous on Sunday, November 28 2004 @ 07:13 AM CET
After reading the spec and thinking about how the bazaar works, I recommend you add the "VGA feature connector" to the spec. Make sure that the pin assignments onto the logic chip are compatible with the signal directions called out in the specification ... then ignore the connector.

In the short term, it will be handy as a high speed debug port. It would be easy to put two cards in adjacent slots and program one to be a high performance data capture service that monitors the feature connector of the other. That will let someone with two cards contribute to cutting edge development (single headed) and then reflash the boot chips with the stable binary for a normal day-to-day (dual headed) display.

In the medium term, someone (not me, thankfully) who has a legacy need for the feature interface might actually generate a patch to the main logic files to implement the proper capability.

In the longer term, it seems feasible to have several boards in a multiheaded configuration that are nominally rendering in parallel. However, for the display seams and the like, it is handy to have a direct connection between the boards. Even if there is not enough space to do T&L in one chip, it might be effective to stream the T&L data to one board over DMA, have it deliver the preprocessed and optimized data over the one inch ribbon cable to the other board, where its DMA channel is delivering the non-coordinate data and these two inputs are merged into the rendering engine.

Feature connector - present but not implemented
Authored by: bart on Sunday, November 28 2004 @ 06:48 PM CET
Out of curiosity, is there hardware around that actually made use of this connector? and if so what kidn of hardware? I have seen the connector quite often (and still have 2 cards around that have one), but I never saw it actually being used for anything other then sticking a mpeg decoder card onto your video card.

Another question is that for all I know the feature conenctor is 8bit. Woudl that be workable with a modern graphics card?
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